Hippeau this year is marking a quarter of a century as a top venture capitalist and he shows no signs of slowing down, having raised another new seed fund, the firm’s ninth. Hippeau started the company, which now counts 400 companies in its portfolio, with Ken Lerer and his son, Ben, all of whom came from the media industry. Ken Lerer at AOL, then AOL Time Warner, and Ben at Thrillist.

Hippeau was publisher of PC Magazine and chairman and CEO of its parent company Ziff-Davis. Hippeau was also CEO of The Huffington Post, where he was an investor. He was a managing partner at SoftBank Capital, serving on the Boards of Yahoo, GeoCities, Danger, and Buddy Media, among others.

Through the years, Hippeau has developed a unique lens on the investing landscape, not just in media but across all sectors, from robotics to defense to healthcare, a view that makes him much sought after by outlets like CNBC (and TheWrap!) to share his perspectives from time to time.

When asked about the secret to successful investing, he has always said it’s about the people, the founders. That, and “we make decisions based on a million small signals,” he said.

We were able to pin down Hippeau from his crazy-busy schedule to answer a few of our questions recently. The following interview has been edited for length and clarity.

This year marks your 25th year as a VC, and 15 years of Lerer Hippeau, the early stage fund you co-founded. Before that, you operated public and private media companies for several decades. How did your days as a media executive inform your successful early stage investing career?

In innumerable ways. I’ll try to keep the list concise. For one, media is, and always has been, about encountering new information, synthesizing it and condensing it. The core exercise for both media operators and venture capitalists is to parse the truly significant platform shifts from that which is merely novel — so it’s made me better at choosing the right companies and leaders with that filter applied. Further, media’s volatile, and has been especially in recent years. That’s taught me not to be surprised or perturbed by much — one just has to keep moving forward, stay laser-focused on tasks at hand, and bring a balanced, empirical mindset to what could otherwise be deeply stressful and emotional.

This perspective is hugely helpful in the business of early-stage company building. I’d also emphasize the importance of storytelling, which is obviously a component to any media business, and one whose importance in the VC world cannot be overstated. Founders must be able to tell their stories. They have to communicate clearly about what they are doing, why it matters, how it will reshape their markets, and how it solves a real human need — at scale. Finally, working in media has also made me significantly more comfortable with the unpleasant business of knowing when to cut bait. As VCs, we can’t be afraid to let our companies pivot, or close down and return money to investors. It doesn’t happen often, but when it does, it isn’t existentially scary. It’s a part of business and we all move forward.

Lerer Hippeau’s portfolio is much more than media companies. What is your formula for deciding which startups to invest in?

You’re right that we had some major wins in media and consumer in our early years at Lerer Hippeau, so we’re fortunate to be known for our prowess there. And, as you say, our portfolio of over 400 companies has always comprised many B2B businesses as well, across robotics, climate, fintech, healthcare and so many other critical sectors.

Choosing the right companies to invest in is an almost laughably challenging proposition, particularly at the earliest stages of investing, where our firm operates. More often than not, we’re looking at nothing more than a piece of paper and some rough projections. Sometimes our only task is to evaluate a founder and believe them when they say they are the right person to build whatever they’re attempting. “Formula” suggests a sort of science, and I would say that our business is equal parts art and science. We make decisions based on a million small signals. For us, it always comes down to the people. Do they have a sophisticated and proprietary sense of their market, product, and timing? Do we believe they’re equipped to build an enormous business? Do we trust them? These are the sorts of questions we consider, and the answers, typically, do not come purely from analyzing an early model. They come down to the founders in front of us. 

M&A has been tepid so far this year, and IPOs aren’t much better. How has that affected your strategy on exits from your investments?

The short answer is that our focus is on finding great companies — rather than exiting them—agnostic of market conditions, so our core business of being a founder’s first and most aligned institutional partner is largely unaffected by later-stage market machinations. That said, we take an active role in helping our founders generate liquidity for early employees, investors, and themselves, through later-stage transactions, M&A, and IPOs. Everyone in our business wants to see a more robust IPO market, which typically spurs more M&A activity as well, and we feel strongly that we need to adjust several factors that are currently making it difficult for companies to go public. Adjusting regulatory and compliance requirements, for instance, for mid-cap public companies will encourage more activity and lower financial burdens that make the option unattractive. There isn’t a silver bullet for this issue and a lot of small changes will accumulate to make a big difference, but what’s non-negotiable is that we must have public markets that are robust and accessible to maintain our place as the world’s most innovative country.

Let’s circle back to media and entertainment. We’ve been reporting a lot on Hollywood’s slow embrace of AI but there are still lots of skeptics. How do you look at AI in this space and what have you invested in?

We think AI will play a critical role in media and entertainment in a manner akin to how it will change other key industries — that’s to say, we’re bullish on companies using AI to augment and complement human ability rather than replace human ingenuity. AI should be used as a tool that unlocks new efficiencies. In the case of Hollywood, we are looking at opportunities that use amazing AI tooling for production alongside human creative and artistic talent. We’ve recently invested in a company — more on that soon — that marries AI and human talent to produce studio-quality movies at a fraction of the cost — allowing independent filmmakers to compete and get their stories told. I’ll call out a couple of other interesting early stage investments we’ve made in media and entertainment as well: TollBit is a tool to help companies monetize the AI agents scraping their content; Mother Games is  an emergent gameplay media and entertainment studio soon to broadly debut its first title.

Besides AI, name two trends in media and entertainment that excite you in the next year or two?  And on the other side of that, what worries you the most?

We think it is difficult at this stage to disentangle AI from the future of media and entertainment. Ultimately we believe that most companies in this space will to some extent be AI companies, much like how every media company today is also an internet or streaming company. So we are deeply interested in the ways AI can be applied to positively shape quality content generation. At the risk of repeating myself, I would also note here that we aren’t interested in AI that aims to replace human talent. We are bullish on the application of AI as an augmenting factor for the processes involved in content production. But to hone in on your question a bit more, two trends we are beginning to see emerge are, (1) an emphasis on individual talent and, (2) hyper-personalized content. We think that media and entertainment will continue to shift more and more toward smaller, independent teams or individual talent and solo creators. The result will be twofold: continued fragmentation, but also hyper-personalization. Consumers flock to content that speaks directly to them. One additional consequence of this will be that loyalty to big brands will fade away — and that pattern has already started.

We think that media and entertainment will continue to shift more and more toward smaller, independent teams or individual talent and solo creators. The result will be twofold: continued fragmentation, but also hyper-personalization. Consumers flock to content that speaks directly to them.

Now, we see a particular downside to this, which I’ve already briefly touched on. We are concerned about what will happen to the quality of content with uncontrolled AI bot scraping. We believe creators and publishers need to be compensated for the writing and content they produce — or we’ll all experience a complete dearth of quality content sooner than we can possibly imagine. Companies like TollBit are working hard to ensure publishers are able to monetize AI bots scraping their content. We are hopeful that an increased industry focus on this space will result in a sustainable solution.

How does the creator economy evolve from here? 

There remains tremendous upside in the creator economy. It’s a natural corollary to our thesis that content production will continue to shift to individual talent and solo practitioners. In other words, AI will serve to amplify what social media started. More and more creators will feel empowered to produce the sort of high-quality, hyper-personal content that commands a returning, sticky audience.

Lerer Hippeau recently raised a new fund. Can you talk about your plans for it? 

With our ninth seed fund, we’ll do what we’ve always done: support early stage founders by serving as their first and most aligned institutional partner. Fund IX is $200 million focused expressly on early stage companies (pre-seed and seed), which we’ll deploy with a singular focus on “finding the best founders before they’re famous,” as we like to say. Though Lerer Hippeau remains well known for our success in early consumer investments, we have always invested across the enterprise and consumer landscapes. With Fund IX, I expect us to invest more in healthcare, fintech, dev-ops and infra tooling, robotics, climate, defense and a number of other sectors. As always — if you’re building something interesting and early, we’d like to know you.

The post Veteran VC Eric Hippeau on What He’s Looking for in AI and Creator Startups appeared first on TheWrap.

Brenner joined the company in 2018, and at first it seemed like a surprising fit. Brenner had cut her teeth working for Miramax in the 1990s, later serving in executive roles at 20th Century Fox and Relativity and producing indies like “Dallas Buyers Club.” Perhaps it’s exactly that foundation that spurred Brenner to enthusiastically hire Greta Gerwig to co-write and direct “Barbie” – and, crucially, to give Gerwig the freedom to make something truly unique.

“For me, I feel like if we’re not trying to raise the bar on every single movie that we’re doing, if we’re not doing something that feels unexpected and that has a reason to exist, then we shouldn’t be doing it,” Brenner told TheWrap for our latest Office With a View. “We want to set the bar really high. And we’ll take swings, and sometimes maybe they won’t work, but at least we’re taking a swing and we’re making bold choices.”

So with Oscars and box office records in tow, Brenner – who was promoted to oversee both film and TV for all of Mattel Studios earlier this year – has set about crafting a slate that is filmmaker-driven, dramatically diverse in tone and has projects set up at just about every major studio in Hollywood.

2026 will see the release of “Masters of the Universe,” a fantasy action epic directed by Laika founder and stop-motion filmmaker Travis Knight. The Amazon MGM Studios release will be anchored by “The Idea of You” heartthrob Nicholas Galitzine and is a “huge spectacle” that “deals with masculinity in a very fun, funny way.” After that is “Matchbox,” a gritty and grounded take on the toy car brand starring John Cena and directed by stuntman-turned-filmmaker Sam Hargrave. That one will stream on Apple TV+.

There’s also an A24 “Barney” movie written by Ayo Edebiri, a “Hot Wheels” movie from “Wicked” director Jon M. Chu and producer J.J. Abrams that’s set up at Warner Bros. and a “Monster High” adaptation at Universal that just tapped “M3GAN” filmmaker Gerard Johnstone to direct.

And, just announced, the “Barbie” craze will continue with an animated film at Illumination Entertainment. “For 66 years, Barbie has been a canvas for girls’ imagination, showing them they can be anything and inspiring their limitless potential,” Brenner said. “Chris Meledandri and the Illumination team are the North Star of animation — visionary storytellers with a remarkable ability to create worlds that are wildly inventive and emotionally rich. We are thrilled to partner with them to bring Barbie’s animated theatrical debut to life in a way that will resonate with audiences of all ages.”

Mattel doesn’t self-finance its projects (yet — Brenner hinted that may be in the cards in the future) so its slate can afford to be diverse and robust.

“To be able to be diversified and to be working in all sorts of places just gives us an opportunity to really move things down the field simultaneously,” she said. “I think it’s a great way to do it, because some people do certain things better than others.”

Through it all, Robbie aims to empower each project’s director to find something unique to say with their respective Mattel property and, hopefully, offer audiences something unexpected.

Read our full interview below to get a look under the hood of how Mattel Studios aims to make-good on the “Barbie” promise of thought-provoking blockbusters.

You were running production at Relativity and producing Oscar-nominated films and indies. What spurred you to join Mattel in the first place?

The movies that I produced and made are movies that are either true life stories or just stories that I feel like for myself need to be told, so the last thing that I was thinking about in my life was coming to Mattel. It really kind of fell out of the sky. I had just met with Risa Gertner, who was at CAA, and we were having a general meeting and she connected me with (Mattel CEO) Ynon Kreiz. We had breakfast one morning and we just really hit it off. I met somebody that was really a kindred spirit, we really saw eye to eye creatively. At one point he said to me, if anybody could be Barbie, who would you imagine it could be? And I said, “Well, Margot Robbie,” and he was like, “That’s so funny, because we’ve been speaking to Margot.” We just really had a shared vision. After more meetings with people at Mattel, I took the job and started two months after he did. My first day, I was looking at all these incredible titles, we have a list of like 200 titles that sit in the Mattel library. I spent the first week that I was here distilling this larger list down to a smaller list of the 40 or 45 movies that I thought can have a real theatrical experience, and then I kind of built from there.

The first film out of the gate is “Barbie” and it’s not only a massive hit, it’s a cultural phenomenon. Did you have an inkling it’d be that big?

Well for starters, that was the last movie that I thought we would make first, just because everybody has a relationship and a touchstone with Barbie. We would have to thread the needle so perfectly. Before even meeting Greta, I think we had heard like 40 different pitches of Barbie and none of them quite got there. Margot brought Greta to the table and I was like “Are you kidding me? If we could have Greta Gerwig direct this movie, forget it. That would be amazing.” We met with Greta and Noah Baumbach and she talked about her love and affinity for Barbie, and she had this idea that it lived in between a Birkenstock and a high heel. I thought that was just so genius. It’s definitely one of the most memorable moments of my life, reading that script. I’d say seeing the movie for the first time, I think we knew how special it was going to be. You could just tell by the visceral reaction to the movie from the very beginning that we had something that was unique.

It’s a great film but it’s also delightfully strange. I have to imagine there was a lot of trust put in Greta that paid off, and looking at the movies and filmmakers you’ve announced, it feels like you’re continuing to invest in artists to paint a unique canvas. Is that something you’re cognizant of going forward, and one of the takeaways from “Barbie?”

Absolutely. For me, I feel like if we’re not trying to raise the bar on every single movie that we’re doing, if we’re not doing something that feels unexpected and that has a reason to exist, then we shouldn’t be doing it. There’s too much noise in the marketplace, you have to give people a reason to want to get off the couch and actually go to the movies. I always like to use the words sticky and different and authentic. We don’t want to create mediocrity. We want to set the bar really high. We want to do things that feel different and unexpected. And we’ll take swings, and sometimes maybe they won’t work, but at least we’re taking a swing and we’re making bold choices. 

I feel like that’s the way we’ve approached the entire slate, whether it’s “Barney” with Ayo Edebiri writing and Daniel Kaluuya producing. And there’s “Masters of the Universe,” which is the complete antithesis of what “Barbie” is. “Barbie” was all about femininity and embracing feminism and the issues around all of that, and “Masters” is fun and it’s a huge spectacle and it’s something totally different. It deals with masculinity in a very fun, funny way. [Director] Travis [Knight] is just a visionary. He’s an incredible filmmaker. I think that people are going to be so delighted with this new rendition. I think people are kind of over swords and capes, and we need to find something different. This movie is heartfelt, it’s fun, the action is amazing. It’s inspirational, it’s aspirational. It’s a coming-of-age story with an amazing, colorful, insane backdrop.

You have so much in development right now. What pushes a project to a greenlight? What makes it a “go” movie for Mattel?

Well, we’re not a studio. We don’t finance our own movies. So we’re somewhat dependent on the studios that we’ve set the movie up at. So it’ll be a combination. For “Barbie,” we were partnered with Warner Bros. and we happened to get a great script in, and so they basically greenlit it from the onset. We’re so excited about “Hot Wheels,” which we also have at Warner Bros., and Jon M. Chu is going to direct it. We’re collaborating with J.J. Abrams and Bad Robot and that script should come in soon, then hopefully we’re going to be off to the races and prepping that movie. We do have limited development funds, and some we decide to work on internally and get a great script, and then attach elements and then go out with it. At this juncture, we’re not financing our movies. I think it’s something that will be in the cards for us in the future, but that’s not something we’re doing. So that greenlight process depends on a third party.

You’re working with pretty much every studio in town. How does that fit into your overall strategy for Mattel’s film slate?

First of all, every movie should live in a different place, right? So “Barney,” the perfect home for it was A24 and we set it up there, and luckily they embraced it and they love it in the way that we do. I think every movie, when you think about it, has its own sort of natural home, and the great thing is that I came up in the business with all of the people that are sort of at the top of all these studios now. It’s so great to have friends and peers everywhere, and I think it really gives us the ability to be nimble and to be able to not be dependent on one financing source, one release calendar. It just gives us more flexibility in terms of the way we navigate through such a robust slate. To be able to be diversified and to be working in all sorts of places just gives us an opportunity to really move things down the field simultaneously. I think it’s a great way to do it, because some people do certain things better than others. 

There’s also no unifying universe. “Barbie” and “Masters of the Universe” don’t have to connect or be in the same style or tone, which feels smart as audiences now seem to have cinematic universe fatigue.

No, I think each property should exist and live on its own. I mean, will there be interconnectivity at some point in the future? Who knows? Would it be fun to make a movie with all of our different brands, like a “Toy Story”-type movie? Absolutely. But we’re not there at this point, I think right now we’re just trying to tell the best possible stories we can to make premium content with the best filmmakers, best in class writers, and just tell exciting stories that bring people joy and warmth, that are family-oriented and that can exist theatrically.

Granular question. I’m excited for “Matchbox” directed by Sam Hargrave, but you also have “Hot Wheels” directed by Jon M. Chu. How do you differentiate between the two?

They’re actually really different. I think with “Hot Wheels,” it’s sort of like a fantastical universe, because you have those amazing orange tracks that go off into nowhere, and it’s really a fantasy play. “Matchbox” is much more grounded, like you have the helicopter driver and the ambulance driver and the policeman. It’s a completely different play pattern. But the “Matchbox” movie, wow. Sam Hargrave is the real deal. He is amazing. He did such a fantastic job. I mean, the stunts in this movie are crazy. I was in Morocco and there were 700 or 800 people working just on one stunt that we were doing. They were driving this car, flipping it over, having it hit 10 cars. And he does these real in-camera. He likes the actors to participate as much as humanly possible.

As you alluded to, it’s a challenging marketplace. “Barbie” was massive. But superhero movies have hit a bit of a ceiling. As you’re plotting out your slate, what makes a Mattel movie stand out? What levers are you pulling to set the films up for success?

I think it all comes back to the filmmaker. It’s finding filmmakers that have a unique and individual voice that sets them apart from anybody else. So that’s the first thing that I’m going to gravitate towards for our movies, is finding interesting voices, and then it’s just finding the most unique way into these stories. Nobody wants to see something that they’ve seen before. They want to feel like it’s unexpected and that it feels different, and that it’s an interesting, different interpretation of what they ever imagined that could be. I think that you’re going to see that in all of our movies. I think that’s the throughline. That’s what we’re aiming for. If you’re not doing something great, then let’s not bother doing it. Movies are very, very hard to make and hard to do well. There’s so many things that need to be aligned and to go right. But I think if you start with a solid foundation of that great story and then you have the vision, then you’re setting yourself up for great success.

You recently got promoted to oversee all of film and television. What’s your approach with the TV slate?

It’s such an exciting time at Mattel Studios just to have television and film under one umbrella, because content is content. Whether it’s short form or long form, it’s just about telling great stories. So it doesn’t matter if it’s gonna be on Peacock or Netflix, or whether we’re going to go consume it at the movie theater. Let’s approach it in the same way. Premium storytelling, great filmmakers, great stories. We just hired Jennifer Breslow who’s running scripted and unscripted TV. She’s fantastic. In the next couple of months, we will be announcing certain shows that we’re putting together with A-list writers and A-list talent at different studios around town for scripted television. Our unscripted business is great. We’re doing lots of fun reality and game shows, and then we have a lot going on on the animation side.

So “Masters of the Universe” is next, and I assume “Matchbox” is after that. Do you know what’s next in the pipeline for film? What’s coming up right behind that?

I’ve got some pots on the stove that are boiling right now, and I have to see which one’s gonna happen. We’ll have one or two that will be going next year that we’re kind of figuring out now. 

Rapid fire round of questions here. Is “Barney” a thriller or a horror movie?

No, no, God no. It’s a beautiful, life-affirming, incredible story. It’s just unexpected and delicious in every way.

“Barbie” sequel. Have there been discussions? Is that happening? Are Greta and Noah working on something?

We all want to make the “Barbie” sequel. When you have such great success, we certainly talk about it. At some point maybe. I don’t know, we will see. There have definitely been discussions.

Ryan Gosling Ken movie?

We would love a Ken movie. We love Ryan.

What can you say about the “American Girl” movie?

The idea is so good and so unexpected. It’s set up at Paramount and it’s gonna be really good.

“Bob the Builder,” which is your first animated theatrical film.

Yes, with Anthony Ramos as Bob. He’s super passionate about it. We’re getting a script in and developing that, and that’s coming along really well.

“Monster High,” what’s going on with that?

Gerard [Johnstone] is directing that, I absolutely love him. He has an unbelievable take. We’re fast-tracking it. We should be getting a script and hopefully we’re making that movie soon.

Is Tom Hanks still attached to “Major Matt Mason?”

Yes, it’s in the works. I love that script. I think it’s so beautiful. Hopefully we’re going to make that. Tom’s just a busy guy and has a busy schedule.

The post How Mattel Studios President and Chief Content Officer Robbie Brenner Is Crafting a Post-‘Barbie’ Slate appeared first on TheWrap.

Point Grey’s relationship with Lionsgate goes back to 2019, when the production studio signed a multi-platform content deal, and then strengthened with the extension of Point Grey’s first-look deal with Lionsgate TV in March 2024 — just as production was beginning on “The Studio.” Before then, Lionsgate and Point Grey had partnered on “Paul T. Goldman” for Peacock and “Santa Inc” for HBO Max.

“[Those] were a little more niche, smaller passion projects, but [I] was always waiting for, ‘what’s the thing that the guys want to do?'” Herbst told TheWrap for the Office With a View interview series. “When ‘The Studio’ came about, it was a great extension of the relationship we already had going.”

As the Hollywood satirical series follows newly appointed studio head Matt Remick (played by Rogen) botching the careful balance between the art and business of filmmaking, “The Studio” is a wink to industry insiders — and triggering for executives like Herbst — but the team tried their best to ensure “The Studio” was relatable for viewers coming from all sorts of backgrounds, similar to “The Office.”

“We’re sitting in a conference room. There’s a Cisco telephone in the middle of the table. We could be anywhere in the world, and the people we’re talking to happen to make entertainment and not sell a product,” Herbst told TheWrap for our Office With a View interview series. “Everyone understands getting your dream job [and it turns out] it’s not what you thought it was going to be.”

“The Studio,” which was ordered to production by Apple TV+ just from a pitch, paid off tenfold for all involved parties, debuting to critical acclaim and this week scoring 23 Emmy nominations, breaking the record for most comedy nominations in a single year and becoming the most nominated freshman comedy.

Six of the 23 nods were for the guest acting, granting Martin Scorsese and Ron Howard their first acting Emmy nominations, while guest stars Bryan Cranston, Anthony Mackie, Dave Franco and Zoë Kravitz also scored nominations. Herbst recalls Howard, who played a mean-spirited version of himself in what Herbst calls “the anti-Ron Howard role,” being one of the first to sign on while Apple TV+ was instrumental in bringing in Scorsese, kickstarting a wave of stars coming on.

“For the most part, we got everyone that they originally wrote into the script … we got a dream cast,” Herbst said. “I know the guys are just so thrilled that we got so many nominations for those guest actors and actresses, so it wasn’t like everyone came and did something that you know wasn’t worth their time. Hopefully [for] Season 2, it’ll be even easier.”

The writers’ room for Season 2 is already underway, with Sarah Polley, who guest starred in Season 1 — (Herbst said Polley not scoring a guest acting nomination was the show’s biggest Emmys snub) — joining the room. “It will be bigger and better than Season 1,” Herbst said.

And, in the meantime, Herbst and his fellow executives working on the show are trying their best to ensure nothing they do gets written into Season 2, with Herbst joking, “That’s the only goal of being an executive on the show. How can I get through this notes call without doing something that’s Episode 4 next year?”

TheWrap: “The Studio” adds to Lionsgate TV’s roster of unique shows that have led the way for the industry, like “Orange Is the New Black.” How do you spot what projects might have that certain something that might push the envelop?

Herbst: As an independent studio, we always hold ourselves to the standard of, why is someone going to make this show from us? If you look at the perennial hits that Lionsgate has, whether it’s “Mad Men” “Nurse Jackie,” “Weeds,” “Orange Is the New Black,” the “Power” shows or “BMF,” these are shows that probably weren’t being pitched by somebody else. We need to be that much more thoughtful, put that much more TLC into a project, and make it that it’s undeniable. Obviously, when we go out, not every show is going to be for every network, but we at least want the networks to know, “Oh, it’s coming from Lionsgate. It’s going to be well-thought through. It’s going to feel like a TV show, whether that TV show is right for that specific platform.” That’s the game.

How did Apple TV+ emerge as the right home for “The Studio?”

We took it to a handful of places — there were only two places that we would have done it that didn’t hear it, because they had shows that fit into the same world of something in entertainment. We had four production offers off a pitch. Everyone says, don’t pitch something about Hollywood, but … coming from Seth Rogen, and “This is the End,” as different of a movie as it was, it proved that when the guys want celebrities to play themselves, they can have a super fun time doing so. We really leaned on that, like, “hey, if you like that movie, and you saw what we did with it, we’re going to recreate that here in an even bigger way.”

What upcoming projects are you excited about?

We have a show called “Hunting Wives” coming out on Netflix next week that’s even soapier and much sexier than “Desperate Housewives,” we have John Grisham’s “Rainmaker” coming out with USA and Peacock in August and then we just did a “Spartacus” reboot for Starz. We did a “Robin Hood” show for MGM+ and “Midnight Sun” for Netflix, which is “Twilight” in adult animated form.

Being an independent studio, we work with all different types of buyers — I think everything I mentioned is at a different network. For us, it’s about being the best independent supplier outside of their home studios that they can get a show from, and it’s certainly working with MGM and USA, two networks that we hadn’t done a ton of business with, and to get two shows on with them that are both coming out within the same year. We’ll do anything for anyone. If we make a good show, the audience knows a way to find it.

You mentioned the “Spartacus” reboot. There’s a handful of reboots across the industry right now that, some are working and some aren’t, like “Suits L.A.” Where do you see reboots and spinoffs’ place in your programming strategy?

Titles give you a little leg up. It’s a little easier to sell. But if I think about my favorite shows, there’s a lot of great original shows also. All the shows we just mentioned that Lionsgate had hits with before, are original, but am I lucky that we have “Twilight” in the library and Stephenie Meyer said, “I would love to do this as adult animation?” I said, “great, let’s make that the next iteration of what that franchise becomes.” We’re kind of agnostic, but, of course, if you can get a big piece of IP, it just makes the sales process a little easier. But I don’t think any show ever gets made because it’s just a hot title. I know there’s some titles that we’ve developed a couple times over that I know everyone wants to make … but the right show just hasn’t presented itself yet. Maybe, if you’re internal somewhere, and your network says, “Well, this title makes sense. Let’s make it,” maybe you rush something. I don’t feel, as Lionsgate, we ever get freebies, and I think that’s good, because it keeps us to a certain standard of the high quality that we want to be doing.

What gaps in the types of projects are you seeing right now in the industry?

Everyone’s making less [and] I think comedy has taken a hit. Because of that, we feel very lucky to have “Ghosts” on CBS, which got renewed for a fifth and sixth season, and “The Studio.” We feel very lucky that we’re one of the players who has having success there right now. The word that I keep coming back to when I’m thinking about pitching shows is entertainment — there were shows that were being made for a while that were chasing something going on in the world and were dark for the sake of being dark. I think now, everyone realizes when you sit at home, you have so many choices of what to watch and ultimately, I think people want to be entertained.

What advice do you have for young people starting out in the industry?

The No. 1 one thing I tell young people is networking and human connection in our business is so important. Even in the Zoom world, though, if you can sit and look at someone on Zoom, it’s better than just having an email relationship with them, but even more so, sit and go have coffee with someone, get a drink, have a meal. Just be in person, because so much of what we do when you’re talking in a creative landscape, it needs to be about two people connecting over the thing. The human connection of the industry is really what it runs on.

And then the other thing I always tell young people is, you want to be aggressive without being annoying, and that’s a very fine line to figure out what that is. I remember when I was going for my first job, the head of HR was who you had to get through to get a job in the CAA mailroom. And I remember saying to her when I was graduating college, I’m going to email you every week until you make me a job offer, you don’t have to respond, but every week you’re going to see an email that I’m thinking that this is the job I want. And after four emails, I had a job offer, and ultimately I didn’t go there, but it was, in my mind, a perfect way to be aggressive without being annoying.

This interview has been edited for length and clarity.

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Melanie Fletcher, whose production company Done + Dusted has been putting on live events across comedy, sports, gaming, music, specials and awards shows since 1998, tells TheWrap’s Office With a View that costs can range from as little as $1 million to as much as $50 million in any given year.

“It’s hard to conceive and stage and produce an event that’s also a livestream of any scale for under a million dollars,” said Fletcher, who serves as Done + Dusted’s North America CEO. “But the smaller events are no easier. You still have to apply all the same energy and love into it.”

The company’s notable live events have ranged from the Victoria’s Secret Fashion Show, which generated 1.2 billion engagements, 22 million live viewers and a combined reach of 305 million to Riot Games’ League of Legends World Finals 2024, which became the most viewed esports event ever with 7 million concurrent views.

Fletcher got her start in Australia as a producer for Saturday morning television programming before moving on to MTV Australia producing for the news division, where she developed a passion for live event storytelling.

“I like to call it the University of MTV, because there were no rules. We we’re making things up as we went and learning on the job every day,” she explained. “I was interacting with MTV offices around the world and very quickly knew that I wanted to go join MTV in America and work on award shows. I just loved the spectacle and the scale and the celebrity of those programs.”

By the late 90s, Fletcher was living in Los Angeles working the award show circuit on programs like the Video Music Awards. She subsequently moved to England to join MTV London, where she worked on the Europe Music Awards and other music specials, and would meet Simon Pizey, Hamish Hamilton and Ian Stewart.

The group would leave MTV to start Done + Dusted, which began producing specials in the music industry when audiences were still buying DVDs of concerts. But as that business shrank, they pivoted their expertise and passion toward other forms of programming. In 2003, they won the contract for the Victoria’s Secret Fashion Show, which was making the transition from internet to broadcast for the first time.

“We helped shape what the format for the worldwide broadcast would be and would go on to produce 16 of those, including last year’s comeback special after a hiatus,” Fletcher said. “As our genre ability broadened, we were able to attract some interest from clients in the US, particularly after Victoria’s Secret.”

Done + Dusted has gone on to build a scaled business in the U.S. in the years since, adding additional creative partners Guy Carrington, Katy Mullan, David Jammy and Adrian Pettett, which gave Fletcher the opportunity to move from hands-on producing into an executive position as North America CEO. 

When asked about the biggest lesson she’s learned in her career, she said being open to learning and willing to adapt – both from a creative and leadership standpoint.

“What I’ve seen around me is those that aren’t able to be agile and flexible and open in their learning, to change, to conversation, to making space for newcomers and listening to new, young, opinionated people, will very soon be irrelevant,” Fletcher explained. “If you don’t love learning, then this isn’t the industry for you. Every day I learn something big and important and new that I need to then apply going forward. And that’s what excites me and gets me out of bed, actually.”

Read on for the rest of TheWrap’s edited conversation with Fletcher below.

You’ve gotten to work on a wide range of events ranging from the Emmys to Beyonce concerts to speeches by President Barack Obama. What was the process like and the challenges of securing those opportunities?

When we first moved here, whilst we had a body of work and a history of some really solid work, we were the outsiders. I really saw us as the underdogs, not the least because we’re a group of different nationalities – there’s Australian, Kiwi, Scottish, South African and then some Brits in our mix – but it took quite some time to get respect from clients.

Our clients have always been quite broad, even more so now, but it’s been the networks and now the streamers, but it’s also been brands and gaming publishers and heads of state and royal families and so on. So to get respected here was just a slow process of producing very premium work and, over time, that work got noticed.

The superpower of Done + Dusted is the eight of us. It’s quite rare to have a group of eight people who run a business together. We can separate and work on a lot of different things at any one time. It gives us a volume, which in turn gives us quite a lot of publicity. One minute, it’s the Emmys, and then the next minute, it’s an inauguration. So just that breadth of work enabled our reputation to spread.

What’s the most difficult or challenging aspect of the work you do in live storytelling?

There’s always a risk with live and we as creatives and producers always want to push the innovation boundary. So we make it even riskier by using new camera technology or doing live demos for tech brands or whatever it might be. We don’t like repeating ourselves, so there’s a high risk that needs to be managed.

The other challenge is the purpose of live. We wrestle with that often. Does it need to be live? Should it be live? Why is it live? Are we the brand and the audience benefiting from this being live? I think it is quite hot right now to be live and sometimes shows are better not live, actually, as an experience to the viewer. So it’s walking that line, and really, if you can go live, make sure that actually there’s a real reason for it.

What do you make of the shift in live storytelling moving from linear TV to streaming as the former’s ratings decline?

Our philosophy has always been quite simple: our work and output always has to be premium, regardless of where it’s going, and we have to have a broad client base and we’re a volume business, which means we should produce the networks, the streamers, the digital platforms and creators and artists because our skillset is tapping into entertainment as a format to solve a problem for someone.

We’re always obsessed with who’s watching this, how are they watching it, when are they watching it, what are their watching habits, is it solving a problem for them, is it engaging them, would they respond to comedy or something intimate or something deep and telling or do they need spectacle to get them off their doomscroll? That mindset takes you out of what can be quite a depressing thought that ratings are dropping and people are not watching live entertainment in the way that they were.

The only true part about that story is they’re just not watching it the way they were. Everyone still loves live and then you get these random rating spikes on some shows and you’re even seeing it on networks. I think live is actually quite protected in that it generates virality, conversation and community discussion. Even if we’re doing it via text or sending memes about a show, however it is, we want something to grab onto to generate conversation with our friends, our colleagues and our families.

On the topic of premium content, what do you make of the rise of YouTube and creator content in the Hollywood ecosystem?

Most creator content, despite its authentic nature, will not be premium and will remain user generated. It will do the job it has set out to do, which is to engage and entertain and often to sell and there’s space for that, and that is proven by the growth in that creator economy.

I’m obsessed with creators. I like to see them as authors and even broadcasters of our content. We see creators as a channel, so we take over their feeds or their handles, and we pump our content through those pipes, get into their subscriber base and it’s proven to be extremely effective, maybe more effective than being on a streamer, because you’re really getting to the consumer or customer base of that brand or artist.

So there is an exciting intersection between creator world and Done + Dusted world. But I don’t think we need to compete and I don’t think we need to compare. I just think we’re really different and we can benefit each other.

As you look ahead, are there any areas you’re not already in that you’re looking to expand into?

A couple of years ago, we took on another partner, Adrian Pettett, who runs a new vertical for us in the immersive experience space. We just thought it was such an interesting and clever way to entertain people and we really saw a future in it. So we invested heavily into that and it’s taken many, many years, but we’re about to open our first original immersive experience later this year in London. 

All good producers are actually entrepreneurs, because they’ve got to be able to take risks. But there’s one thing taking risks in a writer’s room and then there’s another thing taking risks with your bank account, so at some point you have to find out what’s right in the balance for you. 

Are there trends that people should be paying more attention to than they are already?

There’s no question that AI won’t change our business, it will. I’m very interested in trying to understand the best use cases for AI in live and how we can interpret those into our workflow without being obstructive and negative to change. That feels like a big proposition.

I think, particularly with live, how can AI make it cheaper? One-off live events that are from the ground up with no pre-existing event to bounce off are traditionally quite expensive and I would love to figure out a way to produce big spectacle cheaper, because it will help the business as a whole.

I would say we’re still in baby steps of how we apply it, certainly to the administrative business and some of the creative work and using Midjourney and and other design tools. We do a lot of stuff in Canva, which we love, their AI tools are really clever, and obviously ChatGPT. There’s new technology around Cue Pilot, which is how you script camera shots and so on. That’s still in the early days of figuring out how to implement that in a live situation, because it is high stakes when it’s live. That naturally makes you a bit of a control freak, so handing over the reins to AI is still a bit scary for us, but we’re open minded. We want to figure it out.

What’s your advice for someone looking to break into the industry?

My number one piece of advice would be when someone asks you to do something, regardless of what it is, to absolutely nail it, and then the next thing they ask you to do is going to have a bigger outcome, and then absolutely nail that, and then keep going until you’re sat at the table that you want to be at being asked to do the things you want to be doing.

Hard work is unavoidable and you need to turn hard work into something you love. Otherwise, it’s an uphill struggle. Young people need to really figure out what they’re good at and what they want to do and hopefully those two things align. And then they need to work really, really hard because there is no shortcuts.

The post Done + Dusted North America CEO on the Challenges and Opportunities in Live Event Storytelling appeared first on TheWrap.

His YouTube content often tells underdog stories of victims standing up to their bullies, middle schoolers learning moral lessons and even an abusive boss getting a reality check. Five new 25-minute episodes drop weekly — and they’re reaching an audience that spans generations. The content aims to uplift, educate and spark conversation, according to the media mogul.

“If I had to compare our audience to something in traditional media, it’s like Disney Channel meets Lifetime,” Sean Atkins, CEO of Dhar Mann Studios and former MTV President, told TheWrap. “Parents are watching with their teens, and our content lives across platforms where the curve shifts depending on the viewer — older on Facebook, younger on YouTube or Snapchat.”

Now, Mann is scaling his studio’s ambitions beyond viral views. The creator studio has turned its online engagement into real-world impact by taking its show on the road. Dhar Mann Studios Live! aims to engage the “Dhar Mann Fam” by letting fans insert themselves in the content they consume online at home.

TheWrap sat down with Mann and Atkins about how they’ve positioned the studio as a creator-minded alternative to the legacy entertainment model and how they intend to scale and sustain their mission-driven storytelling. The following interview was edited for length and clarity.

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What was it like for you when CAA began representing your studio and people from traditional media started to take notice?

Dhar Mann: When I first started creating content … there weren’t very many people that took us seriously, but it wasn’t just me, it was most of the creator industry. And I have seen firsthand year after year how much the creator industry has grown, how much more interest is coming its way, how people are taking creators much more seriously.

In the beginning, we saw lots of different opportunities coming to creators. You saw licensing deals coming, where people are trying to license catalogs and giving upfront cash in order to get future revenue streams. Now we’re seeing investments happening for growth where large private equity funds are taking interest in creators and studios and putting hundreds of millions of dollars investing in this space. I think the next stage of this is the mergers and acquisitions that are going to start to take place.

One of the services that we have is called the Fifth Quarter Agency, and what we’ve gotten really good at is helping our clients, who are other creators, figure out how to create passive revenue streams through their existing content. One of the challenges of creators today is that when you do publish a video, the earnings of that video taper. Most of the revenue that you’re going to see for a video you’re going to receive within the first week. That creates a lot of anxiety to constantly have to create new content, but we’ve gotten really good at taking the same content and being able to syndicate it across different platforms, without the creator having to do more work.

We’ve helped creators scale up businesses where now they’re making additional seven to eight figures annually just through passive revenue streams.

Sean, you came from the traditional world. What surprised and intrigued you the most about Dhar Mann’s content?

Sean Atkins: I started my career at Disney, so it’s not surprising to me that I’m attracted to content that is generation wide, that is positive and inspirational. Finding someone who built that outside of the traditional ecosystem is really inspirational.

One of the greatest things that Dhar did is he didn’t come from the traditional media business, so he didn’t know all the things you had to do to put heavy overhead on top of business. I think that benefit for a lot of the creators is why they can exist at this very low economic threshold to build large businesses, because it’s a business that really works on volume.

How does the production pipeline differ from your Disney days?

Atkins: In Dhar’s world, they own the distribution. So there’s like no green light process other than Dhar and I talking with our creative teams, and what are we going to do today or this week or for Christmas or whatever it’s going to be. 

If Disney Channel wanted to try and do what Dhar was doing, they first have to figure out the cost infrastructure issue, which is about 1/100 of where they are in today.

His studio basically created the scripted opportunity in digital, and the interesting thing when you think about scripted is that it is the dominant sort of creative structure. If we look at movies, TV, film, books, the fiction side of the equation is really sort of what’s driving it generally, from a revenue, certainly from a cultural impact. Dhar paved the way for that to be possible at scale, on these digital platforms, and in achieving what is basically top rated television show equivalency every night of the week, which is really unparalleled.

Why did you create your own app? Can you unpack that process and monetizing across platforms?

Atkins: In the old world, you were sort of beholden to your business model because it was so lucrative. But when you’re a creator, you don’t have that luxury. You’re always trying to think of what does my audience care about? Where are they migrating? What are they passionate about? What should I be doing for them? So you start to realize someone who might love Dhar Mann on YouTube might not be the same exact viewer who loves them on Facebook.

At the margins that these creators work at and the volume they have to work, making something bespoke for every single platform is very difficult, unless you get a certain amount of scale. But also, at the same time, just taking every piece of content, putting it everywhere, doesn’t mean it’s going to work, because of different platform requirements, platform nuances. 

Were you nervous that your audience wouldn’t follow you to the app?

Mann: In business, my philosophy is you just try a lot of things and see what works. Like Sean said, you are just trying to serve your audience, trying to make your content more accessible, trying to make your content better, trying to meet the viewer where they are on the platform that they are. 

We were very fortunate. When we launched our app, it launched all the way to No. 1 in the App Store globally. Last I checked, I think we had over 4 million users who use the app, so it is incredible seeing the type of reception that it’s gotten. But we’re speaking to other entrepreneurs, and the key is to just try a lot of things and not get so wrapped up in the outcome of everything.

And so, I wasn’t nervous. I was pleasantly surprised, but I’m always very impressed with how engaged our community is.

What’s next for Dhar Mann Studios?

Mann: We’re going to continue telling more brand and entrepreneurial stories. Also, we’re launching a podcast. The podcast will also be a new type of format where we are actually going to be interviewing guests, while also incorporating some of our cinematic storytelling during those interviews.

Atkins: The placement of brands in this sort of ecosystem, and what makes Dhar different in this space is that you have, for the first time, brands who are pretty protective of their brands, and for the first time, instead of having to go talk to a Shonda Rhymes 18 months ago, you can talk to Dhar and have always-on scripted integration, which has never been able to happen before, and at a scale that is unparalleled.

When they come to the facility, their minds get blown because of what [Dhar] built, like a Warner Brothers / Universal level back lot. They start to see, for the first time, the ability to really incorporate brand messages, particularly in the kind of positive, premium environment that Dhar has, and the fact that our consumption is 50% TV based is just the beginning of what I think the turn is going to be on how brands start to work with creators.

The post Dhar Mann Studios Founder and CEO on Ambitions to Become Disney for the YouTube Generation appeared first on TheWrap.

“We spend a lot of time thinking less about linear versus streaming versus editorial, but rather across the board how do we differentiate ourselves in today’s marketplace and even within the Walt Disney Company?,” Monroe told TheWrap’s Office With a View. “It really goes back to the brand, which is always our North Star. That yellow border is our filter for decision making and the brand sits at the heart of everything we do. The strategy is really to tell gripping, factual stories that entertain and also inspire a deeper connection to our world, regardless of genre and platform.”

When it comes to executing NatGeo’s content strategy, Monroe says the focus is on storytelling that will resonate with a modern audience, is bold, unexpected and entertaining, and is “going to speak to one’s head and one’s heart.”

“When it comes to Disney+ specifically, we have the good fortune of having the National Geographic brand tile sit alongside Disney, Marvel, Lucasfilm, Pixar and Hulu. It’s a very, very high bar for entertainment,” she added. “So it’s critical that our content is entertaining and propulsive first.”

After once saying that its linear networks “may not be core” to the company, Disney CEO Bob Iger recently touted the combined advantage of its linear and streaming assets as competitors Comcast and Warner Bros. Discovery plan to spin off their cable businesses into separate, publicly-traded companies.

NatGeo currently reaches up to 487 million households in at least 175 countries and 40 languages, available via linear networks and through the tile in Disney+. Per Disney’s latest annual report for its fiscal year 2024, National Geographic’s linear channels had a total of 66 million subscribers.

Its content was also read by at least 72 million people in the first quarter of 2025 across its digital properties and 52 editions of its magazine published in 23 languages. National Geographic prints 12 magazines annually, although it ceased selling copies on the newsstand in 2023. Additionally, the brand has 782 million followers across all major platforms, generating at least 1.4 billion impressions over the past quarter.

“The power and the combination of linear and streaming and then all of our digital and social platforms is really unrivaled. At this moment, there is such a premium on creative excellence and Bob articulated it best that the combination is much more powerful than them being apart,” Monroe said. “I don’t want to speak to other companies’ strategies. I just know that we all feel really optimistic and confident about the strategy that Disney is pursuing.”

At the same time, the audience declines in the linear business have prompted pay TV operators like Charter Communications and DirecTV to push for more flexibility in their bundle offerings. In a surprising move on Thursday, Charter reached a deal with Disney to restore Disney Jr., Disney XD, Freeform, FXX, FXM, Nat Geo Wild, Nat Geo Mundo and BabyTV to Spectrum TV packages after they were dropped in the companies’ 2023 carriage renewal.

“Obviously there’s changes in the linear channel ecosystem, but we still have a very vibrant and strong linear channel business, not just in the US, but around the world, that gives us the ability to engage a lot of consumers,” Monroe said. “That ecosystem is going to continue to evolve. But when we are packaged inside of the other brands and networks inside the Walt Disney Company, it gives us a huge advantage.”

Check out the rest of TheWrap’s conversation with Monroe below.

TheWrap: Talk to me about your career trajectory and how you landed in your current role.

Monroe: I have spent 27 years in entertainment and over the course of that time, I have worked on behalf of only two juggernaut brands – HBO and National Geographic – which stand for quality above all else.

My first job out of college before that was an ad agency, BBDO. It’s where I fell in love with marketing, storytelling, the creative process and being surrounded by really creative people. I then went and got my MBA at Wharton, because I had a desire just to understand business more broadly, more deeply. When I came out of business school, I took a pretty traditional marketing job at American Express. The job was not a creative marketing job and I really deeply missed being in a more creative environment like I’d been in advertising. So it was at that point I committed myself to continue in marketing and advertising, but I wanted to do it in creative businesses for creative products.

So I got a job at HBO and ultimately spent almost 14 years there heading up all of marketing and digital during what was a really pivotal, cultural defining era at the company. I had the amazing privilege of working on shows like Sopranos, Sex and the City, The Wire, Six Feet Under, Curb Your Enthusiasm and Game of Thrones. That was a very special place and experience in New York City I thought I would never leave.

But then for family reasons, we moved to Washington, DC, where I am now and from originally, because my husband got a job here, and it was his professional turn, but also because my mom was ill at the time. It was an opportunity to be back closer to her when she was sick.

They say everything in life is timing and right after I announced I was leaving HBO, National Geographic television networks, which is based in Washington and was owned by Fox at the time, came calling. I joined as the CMO and two years later was promoted to run the networks business and stayed with National Geographic through the Disney acquisition. My job has continued to evolve, but I would say that never in a million years did I anticipate that move that I made for personal reasons would lead to such a thrilling chapter in my career, nor did I ever anticipate that my job would entail anything other than marketing.

How have your previous experiences helped you in your current role?

I’m very grateful that I got my start in marketing. As a marketer, you’re trained to always think about the consumer first. In our case, it’s the viewer, the reader, the subscriber. But that mindset is really invaluable in every business, no matter how that business is transforming and undergoing change.

Something that hasn’t changed despite all of the significant transition in the business is that, even back when I was at HBO, extraordinary content and storytelling inside a vital brand was the most important. It was essential, and it’s still essential today. The amount of content and the number of platforms changed, but ultimately it’s about creating extraordinary storytelling inside vital brands.

When it comes to attracting the creative talent behind your content, how much of it is you pitching them versus them pitching you?

It’s really a combination of both. We’ve really become a port of call for some of the biggest creative talent in the world. The brand has long attracted the best photographers in the world, but now the same can be said of the talent that works with us in television and film.

People come to National Geographic because of a combination of a couple things. One is the power of this brand really means a lot to people. The other is the scale of our platforms. Talent gets very excited when we talk to them about the content ecosystem that we will leverage to amplify the stories, not just on Disney+ and linear, but also in the magazine, in digital, in social. That’s a very powerful sell to talent that gets them very excited. We’re making things that are very aligned to our brand and we think are really distinctive in the marketplace and within Disney. A lot of the best talent in the world really like the opportunity to tell stories with purpose and that’s what National Geographic storytelling ultimately is.

We get our door gets knocked on quite a bit, certainly in the documentary film space. We’ve really established ourselves as a leader in the feature documentary film space, but really in the series space as well. We have a long standing relationship with Darren Aronofsky and Protozoa Pictures. We have a long standing relationship with Jim Cameron. We just launched a show Underdogs with Ryan Reynolds, which I think is a great example of how we’re taking traditional National Geographic storytelling and turning it on its head to engage a modern audience. And Ryan and Maximum Effort pitched that show to us, its a mash up between premium wildlife and natural history and Ryan Reynolds scripted comedy. We like to say it’s a bit more Deadpool than David Attenborough. It was a very, very quick and easy yes.

Sometimes we will have an idea for something and find the right filmmaker or the production company or talent to front it and sometimes they come to us. This summer, we’re going to launch the second installment of Limitless with Chris Hemsworth, which is a really fun new season. He swore after the first season he wasn’t going to do another one, just because it was really a lot of work and time consuming. But he loved the project and ultimately is really passionate about science and longevity and how to live longer, healthier lives. So he came back to do more with us. We went to him with that idea initially, and now he came back and said he wanted to do more.

How is the rise in artificial intelligence in Hollywood and media impacting the way you think about content?

It’s definitely a conversation that we’re all having. As a company, Disney is super, committed to exploring how to use AI in really responsible, ethical, human, centered ways that respect the individual’s role in creativity, that protect IP. National Geographic photography is authentic and real and we need to protect that. But, like everyone in this business, we’re certainly discussing how it can enrich the stories that we’re telling, empower our creative partners to do their their best work, but also maintain our commitment to being a trusted, authentic brand. I don’t have all those answers, but we’re having all the right conversations.

Are you using the technology currently?

It’s very limited. We’re really not using it at this point. I think some of our production companies are a little bit and we’re in discussions with them, but it’s nascent. We are not on the forefront of that, which would make sense if you think about our brand. It’s all documentary, nonfiction storytelling, editorial. That’s not to say there aren’t ways, but it’s not surprising that we wouldn’t really be on the forefront of that.

What’s your advice for young people looking to break into the entertainment and media industries? For people in the industry looking to take the next step in their careers?

My number one piece of advice would be to say that who you work for matters more than what your job is. The most important thing you can do at every step of your career is to find someone who both values you and makes you better. Whether you’re starting out or where if you just want to level up, I would say relationships are paramount.

It sounds cliche, but it’s critical to treat people with the utmost respect. In my experience, 99% of tension, friction, conflict at work stems from people not feeling respected. So if you approach people and situations with that in mind, it’s amazing how much easier and more enjoyable work will be.

And then I would say to somebody who is looking to level up, have the confidence to surround yourself with people who are smarter, more creative and more capable than you are, and who are willing to tell you the truth, because that is going to make you better and help you level up. I see far too many people who seem afraid to do that and it feels incredibly misguided to me. Always stay curious. The pace of change is unprecedented, so you’ve got to be committed to continuous learning, from day one until your final day of your career.

The post National Geographic Content President Courteney Monroe on Taking a ‘Platform Agnostic’ Approach Amid Industry Shifts appeared first on TheWrap.

Garcia’s path to independent film financing began over a decade ago as an agent/partner at Endeavor/WME, where he packaged and sold films including “The Nice Guys” and “Drive.” He spent seven years at Fifth Season, helping scale the company from its 2017 launch as Endeavor Content into a prolific film supplier, financing and producing over 40 movies including recent Jason Statham hit “A Working Man,” Michael Bay’s “Ambulance,” and the Stephen Chbosky-directed “Nonnas,” on Netflix which was the No. 3 most-watched streaming program of the week, according to Nielsen’s most-watched streaming chart.

The launch of Brass Knuckle Films represents Garcia’s most ambitious project yet— a joint venture with Rodriguez that allows fans to invest in action movies and even pitch their own film concepts. The initiative raised its $2 million target early, attracting what Garcia calls “Warriors” — a community of 2,184 investors consisting of fans, industry disruptors, and dreamers who believe in democratizing film financing.

The following conversation has been edited for length and clarity.

You’ve gone from CAT5 in 2024 to co-founding Brass Knuckle Films in 2025. What drove this rapid expansion, and how do these entities work together strategically?

CAT5 was my exit from Fifth Season, backed by Fifth Season and focused in the action space. The bet I was making was coming out of running a generalist film department where we made 40-plus movies over four to five years. There was never a focused creative strategy — it was about scale and volume. When I was looking at what to do next, I wanted to go completely the other direction. How can I be as focused as possible in a commercial space?

I chose action as the most commercial, internationally friendly space. One of the first calls I made was to Robert Rodriguez, and as I was pitching him what I was doing, I realized I was pitching him his business. He’s always preached efficiencies — telling studios he can make films for less, but then they’d waste the savings somewhere else.

Technically, Brass Knuckle Films is a joint venture between CAT5 and Robert, but anything I want to be doing in the action space, I want it to be Brass Knuckle Films. Going forward, on a new action project, if it doesn’t fit in Brass Knuckle Films for some reason, why would I spend time on it outside of that when we’re building this together?

You raised $2 million from 2,184 investors you call “Warriors.” Can you break down the economics of this fan-investor model?

The terms we gave to those investors — because of the experimental nature and knowing many are coming in for small amounts — were better than what you’d find in the marketplace for development finance. A lot of investors came in at the minimum of $250.

It was less about needing that amount of money and more about building this community for the brand. Part of what drove the campaign was our “Best Idea Wins” contest, where we’ll develop at least one project from an idea submitted by our investors. They have until June 19 to submit their idea. We’ll review all of them, pass some to round two with feedback, then the top ones create videos. Twenty finalists will pitch directly to Robert over Zoom, and we’ll pick one to develop into a script.

What market gaps is Brass Knuckle Films designed to fill that traditional studios aren’t addressing?

The desire and ability to make movies in this genre efficiently. Working with established stars is important in action films, and if you can’t make these movies efficiently, you’re asking stars for three months on set. If you can make it more efficiently, you can slide into slots where we can shoot them out in a month and still make something that looks like it cost $100 million but for a lot less.

The buyers all want these movies with stars. If we can make it more efficiently and figure out how to fit into schedules between their Marvel commitments, everybody wins. We want everybody to win — financiers, talent, distributors. Most in Hollywood are looking for their interest to win, but we can build something where everybody wins.

Action films are globally popular, but the market is crowded. What’s your differentiation strategy beyond the fan-investor component?

There’s a strong desire to be original, but in the action space, over 50% of submissions we receive reference “John Wick.” We’re not looking for another “John Wick” or “Die Hard” in a whatever setting.” This genre is where “programmer” is a pejorative term, but what we’re talking about is something that could reach the broadest audiences possible — and that can often be not cool for executives who want something that can win at festivals.

I don’t think “Fast and Furious” ever got close to a fresh rating on Rotten Tomatoes, but that’s the most successful pure action franchise in history. We don’t want to turn our nose up at the idea that this is a genre that should play as broadly as possible, not just in America but around the world. We’re going to make it cool and original and fresh, but we’re looking for movies that can play to all sorts of audiences, especially those who love action, which is the broadest audience in the world.

What are the next steps now that you’re officially open for business?

We’re identifying writers we love in the genre who either could write something new for us or who might have something that’s been stuck at a studio for a decade or reverted back to them. There’s never been a shortage of studios buying scripts in the genre, but I think the conversion rate is very low when it comes to hot action specs actually getting made.

We’ll also work with actors we’ve been speaking with — what kind of action movie makes sense for this actor plus Robert at Brass Knuckle Films? We want a slate that’s purposeful, not just because it’s all action, but because we know we’re developing this script to make it with this director, this star, in this window, in this way. We can think about all that as opposed to buying a bunch of stuff and seeing how it comes out. We want to develop and already be setting production schedules.

The post Brass Knuckle Films Co-Founder Alexis Garcia on How the Business Is Being Built Through Fan Investors appeared first on TheWrap.

Radio? TV was supposed to kill radio. Satellite radio was supposed to kill terrestrial radio, like those stations operated by iHeart. Podcasts were supposed to kill satellite radio. And whatever comes next.

Pittman beams when he says iHeartRadio has more listeners today than it did 10 years ago. “TV certainly can’t say that,” said Pittman, a co-founder of MTV. The media company doesn’t break out daily listeners but claims to reach 90% of Americans every month through broadcast radio and its streaming platforms. Monetizing for the scale of that audience is a struggle, concedes Pittman, who is constantly making the case for radio’s value to advertisers and to Wall Street, which has been skeptical lately of iHeart’s large debt restructuring. The company has pared long-term debt by $400 million since 2022, but it still stands at $5 billion while the stock price is down to $1.40, a drop of 30% so far this year. Pittman declined to comment on the share price, but his message to the Street has been “we are committed to [finding ways] to operate more efficiently and take advantage of new and evolving technologies.”

And, of course, Pittman likes to point to other media’s reach versus iHeart’s: Consider that among adults 18-34, Spotify has a monthly reach of 43%, YouTube Music has a monthly reach of 35%, Pandora and Apple Music both have a monthly reach of 18%, according to Nielsen.

“Listeners want to hang out with us,” in the car, at home, on their phones, said Pittman. “It’s not about programs, it’s about media in real time.” Many people will check back in on radio seven times during a day, iHeart research shows.

TheWrap recently spoke to Pittman about the future of media, the state of radio, podcasting, how iHeart is deploying technology, and whether he plans to retire — ever. The following interview is edited for length and clarity.

You’ve always been able to see around corners in media, finding the next big thing. Where is the future of digital media headed?

To be honest, I feel like predicting the future is often a fool’s errand. For example, everyone thought the world was going to the metaverse and Web 3.0 — and instead, it went to AI, which turned out to be more powerful — and came sooner than anyone had expected and opened up a lot of new opportunities that nobody foresaw.

So my strategy is not to try and predict the future; instead, it’s to be on the lookout for the future, and to be ready when it shows itself.  

Let’s get straight to it: How could the Trump tariffs impact an ad-dependent company like iHeart?

At this point in time, we’re seeing generally stable ad spend, but we of course continue to monitor it closely due to the lack of visibility. For the most part, our advertisers would not be affected by tariffs. And they learned some valuable lessons from the pandemic, to not overreact. We’re not seeing a hysteria. (During its first quarter earnings report on May 12, iHeart said digital revenue increased $38.3 million, or 16%, driven by demand for digital advertising, including podcast advertising.)

You said recently that iHeart grew to 40% of the advertising revenue and markets for radio as measured by metrics consultants Miller-Kaplan. What’s the plan to grow that slice of the pie?

The biggest argument for the share gain is that given our size, what you’re finding, particularly with the larger advertising partners, is they want fewer partners, not more partners. We certainly would have to be partner number one. And what other partners they have in radio, I don’t know. But I think that’s probably beneficial to us as the industry consolidates.

Events like the iHeartRadio Music Awards, streaming radio options for mobile devices, newsletters and podcasting have all become growing parts of your business since you became CEO. What’s your podcasting strategy?

Podcasting is really radio on demand, just like Netflix is probably TV on demand. It’s an adjacent business to radio. So we have a natural advantage here, not only in terms of creation and knowing how to do it and having the resources to do it, but we also have this incredible promotional vehicle called broadcast radio.

We’re able to advertise these podcasts, promote them, talk about them to an audience that is very audio centric anyway and understands what we’re doing here.

We’ve got the podcasts people want to listen to, and the programs — like “The Clay Travis and Buck Sexton Show,” “My Favorite Murder,” “Here’s the Thing With Alec Baldwin” and “New Heights With Jason & Travis Kelce.” We’ve got a large podcast audience and it’s growing. If you look at Podtrac, which measures podcast listening, not only do we do extraordinarily well overall, I mean a pretty substantial lead over NPR, the second largest podcast publisher, but we’ve also got it diversified across all 19 categories of podcast listening as measured by contract. So I think it starts with that.

How much are you investing in video podcasting?

When you get into how are people looking at podcasting, the vast majority want to listen to a podcast. Are there some people who prefer to watch a video podcast? Well, at that point, it’s not really so much a podcast as much as it is a video show.

Look at the success of YouTube. But I don’t think that’s the podcasting business, per se. I mean, I understand that YouTube would like to take some of that podcasting revenue, and I don’t blame them. But we think the consumer has spoken. And so although we look at it and watch it carefully, I think we’re in exactly the right position and feel very good about it.

How are you deploying technology across the company?

We remain committed to identifying opportunities across our organization to operate more efficiently and take advantage of new and evolving technologies like programmatic and AI, which are critical to delivering short-term results and long-term growth even during periods of economic uncertainty. Much of how we use AI is in mining data to better understand our audience, the consumer. We are also using technology and AI to hit our target of $150 million in net savings in 2025.

You’ve partnered since 2020 with Malcolm Gladwell’s Pushkin Industry to study the relationship between consumers and advertisers, and you make those findings public. Why do that?

We’ve always been grounded in reality about who the majority of our listeners are. The average American household has an annual income of about $70,000. The biggest purchases are maybe $1,000 or maybe $2,000 a year. It’s important to know that, for example, 44% of them believe they are underserved by advertisers. Marketers live in big cities and don’t commute as often as the average American, don’t necessarily understand the huge role that broadcast radio and podcasts play in people’s lives, particularly in the car. So it’s a matter of checking biases at the door.

You’ve spent the vast majority of your career in leadership roles in the media business and you’ve ridden the waves of never-ending change. What advice would you give to somebody looking to be a leader at a media company?

It’s pretty simple. Ignore the headlines, and focus all your energy on your consumers. And just keep asking yourself: How can I stay current?

Ok, ouch on ignoring the headlines but I get your message. One last question: You’ve been working in media since you were 15 with your fair share of wins over a long career. When do you think you will call it quits?

Listen, business is my golf. As long as my health holds up and my board wants me here, I will continue to do what I love.

The post Bob Pittman on 50 Years in Media and What He’s Not Saying About the Future appeared first on TheWrap.

Black Cinema Vertical, which launched in February is a new initiative from Filmhub that assists Black filmmakers with getting their film and TV projects distributed across more than 120 streaming channels, including Apple TV+, BET and Amazon’s Prime Video. In addition, the sector prioritizes creatives’ ownership goals, offering exclusive and non-exclusive deals.

Maurice, a film executive with 15 years experience, says his advocacy and passion for creating pipelines for Black filmmakers was rooted in his awareness of the racial disparities Black creatives face in the industry.

“As a community, we spend so much money at the box office, and also, like, at Walmart and Target … The amount of titles [by Black people] being produced or distributed by the studios doesn’t add up,” Maurice told TheWrap. “That’s when why I want to be an advocate for this industry … So far, it’s been 500 titles independently that I’ve released as an executive, and it’s always growing, but it’s been a it’s been a ride so far, and I’m super excited what we’re building at FilmHub, because now we just, tripling down about the level of commitment that we are putting, working and partnering with a lot of Black filmmakers.”

Read on for Maurice’s full Office With a View interview, edited for length and clarity.  

How did you come to head up the Black Cinema Vertical (BCV)?

FilmHub was already operating before I joined the company, but when I was working at my previous company, I met the founder, Alan d’Escragnolle, and he, from afar away– I was very impressed with what he was building, because a lot of the filmmakers that I was helping or the ones who would come to me for distribution operation companies, they would always ask me about FilmHub, because FilmHub had a great reputation with the flood of filmmakers. 

[Alan] took notice of what I was doing and my past experience. He knows about my passion and what I want to do. [FilmHub was] were already in the business, but they didn’t have an actual vertical committing to the elevation of Black filmmakers and Black films. And since FilmHub was partnering with a lot of those filmmakers already, it only makes sense for me to come on board to oversee and manage those titles and also to start leveraging past relationships I’ve had working with the streamers.

A lot of people are talking about Ryan Coogler and his Warner Bros. deal. With you and BCV being such advocate for Black filmmakers’ rights and options, what do you think about his push for ownership?

I’ve always been an advocate for Black filmmakers, and in this new era of the creator economy, it’s clear that filmmakers have more power than they realize. Ryan Coogler just handed them the blueprint for how to shift the power dynamic in Hollywood.

While many filmmakers are still giving up their IP for upfront checks, Coogler is reclaiming a model rooted in legacy, sustainability, and community ownership. 

He didn’t need an algorithm, just vision, cultural capital, and the courage to demand what he’s worth.

That same spirit is what we’re building at Filmhub through the Black Cinema Vertical an initiative I’m proud to lead. With access to over 150 global streaming platforms and the largest Black film catalog in the industry, we’re breaking down barriers and ensuring that Black filmmakers own their stories, their rights, and their future. 

Do you feel like if there were more people who looked like you in Hollywood that ultimately more Black creatives and stories would be supported?

Yeah, I believe so. Like this whole DEI conversation … sometimes people don’t understand acronyms, or they just make up their own definition of what DEI is. It’s always about representation. If it’s always the same people in the room, how do you understand the value of another community? We as a country are getting more diverse and the audiences’ tastes are very different. If you keep feeding them the same type of films where everybody looks the same, it doesn’t— it doesn’t make sense as a business for you to do that.

What I try to do, usually, is use data, math. At the end of the day, everybody can understand that. When you pay attention to the box office and us as a community, how much we spend at the box office and how much we consume. As a company, don’t you want to distribute or create content for the population that spends so much money? Understanding how to articulate and translate those numbers to decision makers is going to be a challenge for a lot of us moving forward, because as you can see, every time you talk about anything Black, it’s classified as being DEI or its a race conversation, which is not even what we are talking about.

What are the biggest challenges Black filmmakers are facing?

From my experience, filmmakers get excited about pre-production and production; that’s where they spend all their energy because they’re creatives, that’s how they are. But in reality, the No. 1 thing we should consider is the distribution strategy. Like, where do you see this going before you start shooting. You shouldn’t think about distribution after your shoot because sometimes distribution might take five, six, seven months. Most channels have partnerships with distributors, there are dates and commitments when titles have to be tied to them for programming. That’s the No. 1 issue I face with filmmakers, them understanding the distribution part of the business. That’s something they need to know during pre-production and even while in production. You’ve got to have a clear idea and strategy that for your title when you release it. Do your research.

What are some of the exploitive tactics you’ve seen be used in the industry?

The great thing [BCV) does when we work, we offer two different options: We have an exclusive agreement and a non-exclusive agreement, depends on the strategy you want to do as a filmmaker. But it’s very common for most distributors … they’ll do what’s called exclusive agreement, and usually that exclusive agreement is 10 to 15 years. And most of the time, those distributors get the title and it’s just a number [to them], sometimes there’s no strategy. They don’t put any emphasis on it, or even collaborate with you. But for us, we have the exclusive part of our business and a non-exclusive, where it’s very flexible. And if the filmmaker is not aligned with our strategy and what we’re doing, we give them the option to take the title back work with somebody else. We don’t try to force you to stay in an agreement for a long time when you’re not happy. We try to be flexible as opposed to one option.

When you think about everything that’s going on with the Trump administration’s anti-DEI movement and the rollback on DEI efforts in Hollywood, how do you reflect on the work you do for Black filmmakers?

I’m very proud of the work I’ve done in my personal life and what we’re doing at FilmHub. You always think about going to Hollywood or even New York when you think of entertainment, but we have filmmakers in Mississippi. Detroit is becoming a hub for Black cinema. There are so many different filmmakers around the country and we want to showcase that; I think it’s a beautiful thing.

What advice would you give your younger self?

Don’t be too hard on yourself. There’s such joy and learning from failures, because you’ll be able to use that as a strength. So just prepare yourself in the process while on the grind. Failure is going to come and go; don’t beat yourself down, just learn from it.

The post The Head of Filmhub’s New Black Cinema Vertical Says a Lack of Diversity in Films ‘Doesn’t Make Sense Economically’ appeared first on TheWrap.

“A lot of the networks, platforms and cable channels have a certain amount of money they can spend in a year, and they want to put it toward something that’s going to be a landmark,” Pizzi told TheWrap’s Office With a View. “Everyone’s looking for ‘What’s our ‘Traitors’? What’s our ‘Squid Game,’ What’s going to put us on the map?’ ”

Creating hits was never an issue for Bunim/Murray, the Banijay-owned production company behind unscripted staples like “Keeping Up With the Kardashians,” “The Challenge” and “The Real World” franchises. Pizzi started her career at Bunim/Murray, spending 25 years developing and producing unscripted projects. She rose to CEO in 2021 and started overseeing “The Challenge” franchise. Then she added oversight of Banijay’s 51 Minds Entertainment to her roster in 2023, which produces four iterations of Bravo’s “Below Deck” franchise.

But Pizzi, one of the few women to lead multiple production labels in the unscripted field, noted that even her companies faced the toll of the contraction. Some “fully developed” projects that had been sold ended up not receiving series orders, leaving her and the development team “scratching our heads.”

“We were fortunate to have enough shows that are franchises so still had those commissions, but we really do bank every year on selling new shows, and our whole business is based on growth,” Pizzi said. “You really have to continue to elevate the shows that are on there, and then really be looking two years forward.”

While navigating the changing waters of television development, Pizzi and the Bunim/Murray team have pivoted to approaching buyers directly with ideas tailored to their desires, rather than coming up with an idea and taking it to multiple potential platforms.

At the same time, Pizzi is also making the shows she sells. She oversees “The Challenge” franchise, which airs on MTV, CBS and Paramount+, and currently serves as executive producer on Season 2 of Hulu’s “Vanderpump Villa,” premiering Thursday, and Lifetime docuseries “Confessions of Octomom.”

“The biggest challenge isn’t getting networks excited about our show. It’s about really them finding the money to do it the way they want it done.” Pizzi said. “It’s really about budget, but I feel like there is an upturn right now.”

The interview that follows has been edited for length and clarity.

So now when things are kind of picking back up a little bit, are you feeling a little bit more optimistic?

I am. Obviously, I don’t have a purview into what the budgets actually look like for this year. But what I will say is that our development team has been working on really big shows. Most of our development right now that we’ve been doing is really per network. We’re talking to networks in advance and then really crafting what they’re looking for. It’s much more a point-of-purchase collaboration, where it’s like, “I’m only talking to you, tell me exactly what you need and then we’re going to go back and develop that for you.” As opposed to in the past, when we would come up with an idea and then we would try to sell it to five different places.

Bunim/Murray has worked on some of the biggest franchises in reality TV history, from “Real World” to “The Challenge,” which is still running strong. How do you keep a franchise like that running as Hollywood changes so rapidly?

“The Challenge” is the only format that we literally change every year. As long as I can remember working on this show, we do a brand new look, brand new theme, new country, new location, new tone, look, everything every single year. So even though mostly all episodes have an elimination or game, the lens in which we’re casting and the game in which we’re playing is constantly evolving. To MTV’s credit, that’s their ask every year. They realize this show is 41 seasons deep and the audience wants that. Sometimes we’ll bring back a format from a decade ago, but that show stays fresh just by the nature of it.

With other shows, we have our second season “The Never Ever Mets” (on OWN) starting to air, so it’s still a brand new format. We’re refreshing with a location and our characters, but we’re really just evolving the stories. And “Vanderpump Villa” Season 2 is delicious. We were able to implement things that we discovered in doing the first in a different location.

Your companies do the bulk of your shows for cable networks, as media companies start moves to offload those assets from their portfolios. How does something like SpinCo, or Hearst telling its staff they’ll likely sell their share of A+E Networks impact your approach to pitching?

Those are very top-level deals that are being done. But most of what you’re talking about is where the shows air. And then also, what is the budget and what are the profits of those entities. We’re content creators, so we’re making the programming. The one thing I will always say about Bunim/Murray is that most of our shows are usually the biggest shows on any of those cable platforms. We can give people a hit. So I look at shows like “Below Deck” and I look at “The Challenge,” “Married to Real Estate.” These are shows that are deep into seasons and that perform for all these platforms.

The networks are trying to figure out how they want to display what they own. Our job is to create good content for them. Wherever they decide to put it, however they decide to split it up, I don’t think it diminishes the value of those shows. If anything, I think it creates opportunities for those shows to be showcased further in different ways.

OWN is airing Season 2 of “The Never Ever Mets,” bringing a new set of couples who’ve never met in person before into a house in LA. How did you work to have production here as so much of the reality TV industry moves their productions to other states or overseas?

There is a difference. “Never Ever Mets” is in a very contained environment. It’s a house show. It’s very low to the ground. When you scale a show that needs stunts and you know you need an art department full time, you’re looking at 150 to 200 people. That’s where it becomes very hard to produce a show here, just because that can become really expensive in Los Angeles. Not because of the people, but because all those people need vehicles and hotels and per diem and, in other parts of the world, those expenses are less.

What needs to happen so reality TV productions can return to California? What can industry leaders do to help make it happen?

For some reason, there was a complete carve-out that unscripted shows don’t have the benefit of any of those (tax) rebates, and that does feel personal. That said, I do believe if there was a way that it could be more cost-efficient to shoot in L.A., I would assume that people would. We shoot a few shows here.

You are prepping for the launch of Season 2 of “Vanderpump Villa” with Lisa Vanderpump. How did you approach getting that show on Hulu?

Lisa and I had met about another project years ago, and then we reconnected and we pitched her this idea and we developed it together. The show really is her vision. And that is because she was very much a part of the creative process, and then when we had the opportunity to take it out Hulu just fell in love with it.

It’s really taking that [“Vanderpump Rules”] concept and then merging it with our “Real World” DNA and that just blossoms into “Vanderpump Villa.” The cast is living together. They don’t really know each other when they move in. To live in a villa and then work, it’s an extension of what we started doing 35 years ago and it continues to be as entertaining as you think it would be because people getting to know each other always comes with romance, clashes, drama and a lot of comedy.

The “Below Deck” franchise continues to grow, and it seems like Captain Jason from “Down Under” is helping anchor an even bigger spotlight for the shows as a companion to the uber-successful “Housewives” franchise. Why do you think those shows have stood out so much in a crowded reality space?

It really is so good. I inherited it when we took over 51 about 18 months ago and am just immersing myself into the world. We have incredibly dedicated captains, the showrunners and the teams that work on these shows have worked on them for a very long time and they’re so committed to it. We actually have different network executives for each of the franchises too and they know it so well. And it’s the casting too. Every year they bring in some new people and then we have some returners. I think that’s a really smart strategy, because the audience does, especially the Bravo audience, really fall in love with characters.

The other thing, which is very similar to “The Challenge,” is that every season we’re looking at a new location. That is part of “Below Deck.” Sure, they revisit places, but even “Med” mostly focuses on ports in the Mediterranean. Being able to see a new world every season and then also new guests, new cast working on the boat.

And one thing that actually even surprised me going into that franchise is how authentic the stories are. They’re not producing the cast. The first time I went on the boat, I’m like, “This is actually a real job.”

You inherited “Below Deck” recently and, like any long-running franchise, there are controversies and headlines that come with them. How did putting the “Below Deck” franchise into your umbrella impact the way production is done on these shows?

“Real World” was on the air for 30+ seasons. “The Challenge” 40+ seasons. We know a thing or two about what can go wrong, and we’ve also learned a lot about how put policy in place to create a safe environment for our cast and crew. So we did work closely right out of the gate with NBC to put policy on paper for the show. And by the way, a lot of this already existed, it just wasn’t papered.

And what we do on “The Challenge” as well, we do a meeting with the crew and then we do a meeting with the cast before we even start rolling cameras. We take respect in the workplace and sexual harassment trainings. We’re very serious about it.

You have a project anchored by Megan Rapinoe and Sue Bird in development. How does leveraging talent help in getting shows greenlit?

I do think when you have women like Megan and Sue, it does matter. Especially because they’re willing to sort of participate in the creative process. There are some shows that people are EPs of, and then there are the shows that they’re deep in the production process. You see that on “Vanderpump,” Lisa is deep in that show. When we did “Buddy Games” with Josh Duhamel (at CBS), he was not a passive EP. He was in the games, testing the challenges.

When you have somebody who’s really passionate about a subject, it does make a difference. But that said, I don’t always know that an attachment in name alone will get something to the finish line, passion and commitment does.

Who or what are you excited to work on next?

We have some of the most exciting game formats right now. We’re working directly with buyers on them and I can take no credit for them, because it’s really this incredible development team. They are really next level. There have been shows that have really moved the meter in the last year. Everyone was talking about how big certain shows were — “Traitors,” “Squid Game,” “Beast Games” and all of that. I feel like we have stuff that sort of competes with those, not the budget, but with the creativity and the shock value.

The post Bunim/Murray CEO Says Hollywood’s Contraction Changed the Pitch for Reality TV appeared first on TheWrap.